Bottom end of mix/Sub Bass

[Myfirstcasio]

Hi Everybody,

I am having some real trouble with sub bass sounds atm. As an example of the kind of bass I am looking to achieve checkout hollow mind and Aritek's tracks, especially Hollow Minds "Euphoria" -

http://www.myspace.com/hollowmindmusic

http://www.myspace.com/arhitek

So, basically, I must be an idiot becuase I cannot get anything that deep, full and spacious! When I drop my bass down in pitch the frequency peaks start to appear and it throbs like an IFO and even if I avoid that it really fatigues my ears when records like the ones linked above do not at all!

I am generally tinkering with various combinations of sine/saw and organ type wave forms with lots of low pass on them (using predator), layering them with the kick, creating indipendent basslines, whatever, nothing works. I have also given Maxxbass a go to see if that could help and it hasn't... I think I must just be missing the point of how to make these kinds of powerful low ends...

Any advice would be greatly appreciated guys! Regards...

[Stomper]

the point of sub bass is almost no harmonic content in the sound, maxbass is to add harmonic content, so theres no point for that for what you want.

try only a sine wave with no layers, or a pulse with different pwm settings and very closed 24db filter (or 2 pulses layered in different octaves)

[livecollective]

If you want full, spacious music and big sub bass, TURN DOWN YOUR SUB BASS, turn it down to -12db and start your kick at -6db and go from there.


You'd be suprised how much louder everything gets when you are not taking up so much energy from the bass.


Less bass is more bass.... seriously though.

[Myfirstcasio]

Cheers guys, I have been doing a bit more mucking about and I'm getting some head way, I actually found it much easier once I stopped using Predator for the sub bass, great for regular bass lines but not for sub-sounds it seems. When I was turning down the LP filter it was just making a mess. Abletons Analog seems to work better.

[damagedgoods]

Couple of tips:

1) Depends on the situation of course, but the effectiveness of a sub bassline is only about 20% dependent on the bass itself. It's really important to pay attention to what's going on *around* the bass, because a pure sine wave needs to be given space in order to work well.

2) I've recently discovered the joys of making subs with additive synthesis, eg Operator using the harmonic graph - you can add whatever harmonics you want. Great for very subtle saturation or warming for example; just start with a sine and add the next couple of odd harmonics, tailing off very quickly. You're basically accomplishing what you would with maxbass or a filtered square, but in a much more controlled way; and it's possible to beef up a pure sine while still maintaining a fairly clean sound.

3) Don't overdo it. Chances are the bass sound you want is actually a lot simpler than you think.

4) Keep your subs in mono.

[Myfirstcasio]

Couple of tips:
1) Depends on the situation of course, but the effectiveness of a sub bassline is only about 20% dependent on the bass itself. It's really important to pay attention to what's going on *around* the bass, because a pure sine wave needs to be given space in order to work well.

By the space around the sound, do you mean freeing up the frquencies around the sub (creating empty/silent content) or paying attention to additional harmonics in this space?

2) I've recently discovered the joys of making subs with additive synthesis, eg Operator using the harmonic graph - you can add whatever harmonics you want. Great for very subtle saturation or warming for example; just start with a sine and add the next couple of odd harmonics, tailing off very quickly. You're basically accomplishing what you would with maxbass or a filtered square, but in a much more controlled way; and it's possible to beef up a pure sine while still maintaining a fairly clean sound.

Great tip! I will try that out tonight!

Thanks!

[damagedgoods]

Couple of tips:
1) Depends on the situation of course, but the effectiveness of a sub bassline is only about 20% dependent on the bass itself. It's really important to pay attention to what's going on *around* the bass, because a pure sine wave needs to be given space in order to work well.

By the space around the sound, do you mean freeing up the frquencies around the sub (creating empty/silent content) or paying attention to additional harmonics in this space?

Both, but I actually meant the mix as a whole. When you have quite a stripped back arrangement (which IMHO is where subs work best), the effectiveness of the sub is directly related to what the hihats and percussion and everything else are doing. I guess what I'm trying to say is that from a psychoacoustic standpoint, the purity of a low sine wave means that its interpretation by the listener's ears depends a lot more on its context than, say, a big fat saw lead, which leaves very little to the imagination...

[damagedgoods]

case in point: listen to deadly deep subs by dillinja. then listen to slap by umek.