A message from Mad Mike..........

[adhesif]

i cannot beleive how this thread turned out !
some people cannot see the wood for the trees, juan deserves the respect and recognition, i hope this award thing goes his way!

[John Clees]

i cannot beleive how this thread turned out !
some people cannot see the wood for the trees, juan deserves the respect and recognition, i hope this award thing goes his way!

he's well paid as Torque said and he never has to worry about money again in his life .. I hope he wins and they play Cybotron at the oil change places.. I just don't see the point of deMANDing a vote because owe it to the (MAGIC) to end end up making more money from commercial hip hop

How am i being a bully to anybody?

you talk at people instead of to them.. as if you are talking down to someone * call me sensative..


Thank you. Ricardo defines an artist who constantly experiments and therefore is an innovator. You can't experiment or be innovation with someone else sounds? That makes no sense. sure if you looked at if from the (did you make the sounds) well no....of course you at that angle it wouldn't be... that goes without saying.......however you COULD be in fact innovation in the way you approached, programmed, sequenced and layered a track/sample/sound.

what do I mean.. ? why would you say you’re going to let that slide.. (you don't have a choice son)... . * meaning I felt it was intimidation YOU choose to write..

Can anybody please point out any case where I said anything even close to that?

Sure, glad you asked. One time on massager you had some said comment like if the change is not perfectly at *edit * this or that we don’t even listen to it..

THAT is WHERE that is coming from..

Some of my post points are how I feel, what I've gathered, and what I've seen over 10 years + about (the music) and then and now... why continue to put more profit into artist that wrote a track or two 20 years ago.. why are you so concerned? the topic at hand is him working with a hip hop artist ... are you kidding me.. to make more millions.. but yet your demanding and/or I feel you were for people to vote......

Can you honestly see how that is not a little muddy..

this is is no way about facts about Detroit... i'm sure your a buff..

NO ONE here to my knowledge is even remotely trying to take away from what Juan Atkins has done.. That is pointless.

It's a REMIX John meaning that he's using pieces of audio with sounds that Rob has been using for years

Thanks for the in-depth break down.. I'm very much informed now...

to complete a track it's you. I’ve been coming to you as a friend for over two years asking you to make some damn music so I can hear it. I’ve had the ability to put it out for over a year and a half with worldwide distribution if the record is good. But I have heard nothing, nothing at all, not even one complete track.

My music is sacred to me. In 10 years I've only gave it to apx 3 labels. I don't do it because it's the (it) now.. nor the trends, nor for status..

I produce first for spiritual reasons and also use it as a platform for a creative outlet.

* I appreciate the fact that you approach me and have me in mind for project ideas. I'm sure you get asked all the time. I am thankful.

Perhaps I'm not sending you tracks because I don't buy the music your guys distribute. Why send it to a place I'm not buying from? Not to mention having a 4 year deal that I would never even remotely consider.

It's official now.... .

I had a few in the wings for you but.........I refuse to share my music now with chat room bully. hahaha..

the hell are you talking about John it can't be me because I never said anything like that

If I said CLIFF YOU SAID.. this would be applicable however I did believe it or not actually state how I felt in my post.. It wasn't all your quotes your holly majesty.

I don't understand where this is all coming from John. Is this you taking a dig at the music Me, Brian Kage, Jon or anybody else that does what we do makes?

No I'm just being silly you should know that. . I think any music is in two categories myself.. Electronic or not.... so you’re using the term (we) so you’re indirectly agreeing that you would call your own music metallic techno.. Ha-ha. You are seeing the light my brother....

If so, why? Where is this hostility coming from and why do insist on putting words in my mouth?

If the music I am into is spiritual for me and you come on a (mnml) board showing arrogants and opening up bad energy.. it's IS personal sucka.

Again I'm not nor did I say you SAID everything I felt and/or wrote..

You’re assuming such things.

Are you just mad because I don't like everything you like?

Do I really need to answer this...? Are you getting all soft on me Cliff..

this was fun.. But again as I said from my other post.. I would respond in a way I would from a perfect stranger... .. That fact that I know you has nothing to do with my Reponses.. Let’s keep it light... *or are you always a HARD ass..

ha-ha ok ... that's it Clifford.

[Torque]

Innovation:
definition #1: a creation (a new device or process) resulting from study and experimentation

Thank you. Ricardo defines an artist who constantly experiments and therefore is an innovator. You can't experiment or be innovation with someone else sounds? That makes no sense. sure if you looked at if from the (did you make the sounds) well no....of course you at that angle it wouldn't be... that goes without saying.......however you COULD be in fact innovation in the way you approached, programmed, sequenced and layered a track/sample/sound.

Whateverthefuck dude. You call it innovation, it just sounds like techno to me.

what do I mean.. ? why would you say you’re going to let that slide.. (you don't have a choice son)... . * meaning I felt it was intimidation YOU choose to write..

Can anybody please point out any case where I said anything even close to that?

Sure, glad you asked. One time on massager you had some said comment like if the change is not perfectly at *edit * this or that we don’t even listen to it..

Massager? You sure i was there? Because i don't remember it. Sounds like you're confusing your gay fantasies with real life. All joking aside though, it's a good thing you edited out what you said because "12/24" made absolutely no sense whatsoever. If you're going to quote me at least try to remember what you're quoting.

THAT is WHERE that is coming from..?

Some of my post points are how I feel, what I've gathered, and what I've seen over 10 years +. NO ONE here to my knowledge is even remotely trying to take away from what Juan Atkins has done.. That is pointless.

It's a REMIX John meaning that he's using pieces of audio with sounds that Rob has been using for years

Thanks for the in-depth break down.. I'm very much informed now...

to complete a track it's you. I’ve been coming to you as a friend for over two years asking you to make some damn music so I can hear it. I’ve had the ability to put it out for over a year and a half with worldwide distribution if the record is good. But I have heard nothing, nothing at all, not even one complete track.

My music is sacred to me. In 10 years I've only gave it to apx 3 labels. I don't do it because it's the (it) now.. nor the trends, nor for status..

I produce first for spiritual reasons and also use it as a platform for a creative outlet.

* I appreciate the fact that you approach me and have me in mind for project ideas. I'm sure you get asked all the time. I am thankful.

Perhaps I'm not sending you tracks because I don't buy the music your guys distribute. Why send it to a place I'm not buying from? Not to mention having a 4 year deal that I would never even remotely consider.

Dude, reality check. You have to HAVE music in order to send in a demo. The you get offered a contract if they like it. You never even tried. You're talking like i came up to you with papers to sign. Not even close, all i wanted was a demo. I thought it was a nice thing to do because i had a hell of a time getting my music heard by submerge, But i guess submerge is not good enough for you. Turning your nose up at us? Well then i guess you can take your non-existant demo to another worldwide techno distributor to be not listened to. Unlike other places we listen to 100% of the demos sent to us.

It's official now.... .

I had a few in the wings for you but.........I refuse to share my music now with chat room bully. hahaha..

the hell are you talking about John it can't be me because I never said anything like that

If I said CLIFF YOU SAID.. this would be applicable however I did believe it or not actually state how I felt in my post.. It wasn't all your quotes your holly majesty.

I don't understand where this is all coming from John. Is this you taking a dig at the music Me, Brian Kage, Jon or anybody else that does what we do makes?

No I'm just being silly you should know that. . I think any music is in two categories myself.. Electronic or not.... so you’re using the term (we) so you’re indirectly agreeing that you would call your own music metallic techno.. Ha-ha. You are seeing the light my brother....

If so, why? Where is this hostility coming from and why do insist on putting words in my mouth?

If the music I am into is spiritual for me and you come on a (mnml) board showing arrogants and opening up bad energy.. it's IS personal sucka.

Again I'm not nor did I say you SAID everything I felt and/or wrote..

You’re assuming such things.

Are you just mad because I don't like everything you like?

Do I really need to answer this...? Are you getting all soft on me Cliff..

this was fun.. But again as I said from my other post.. I would respond in a way I would from a perfect stranger... .. That fact that I know you has nothing to do with my Reponses.. Let’s keep it light... * can your hard ass metallica techno guys do that or are you always a HARD ass..

ha-ha ok ... that's it Clifford.

Dude, you're killin' me here. My sides are hurting from laughing so much. My IQ drops 20 points just by reading what you write. You have to be puttin on a show man.

[John Clees]

glad your smiles clide... but for the sake of the red dog... stop quoting big post ...

and remember...

[minimal house]

So none of you think that the genre of minimal techno owes it's ass to Juan Atkins? Who do you think created techno Richie Hawtin?
This has nothing to do with Detroit, this has to do with a chance to give an actual innovator in electronic music a chance at recognition that he has deserved for longer than some of the people on this board have been alive.

Well minimal techno is not a genre, its a sub-genre ; )

I put Juan in the same boat as musicians (note: musicians) like Jessie Saunders, Jamie Principle & Knuckles, Bambatta, Jefferson, Roni Size etc.

And all due respect to Ricardo, Pronsato, Luciano even Robert Hood... but they are not innovators. Creating a sub-genre does NOT = innovation in my eyes. Creating a whole new genre from scratch = innovation.

[Torque]

I'm sorry, i should have thought about it more before i typed it. Minimal is a Sub-Genre and probably the best sub-genre of techno to come into prominance for a while, but it's also a very narrow one and extremely specialised.

[John Clees]

When we first got electricity it was exciting... or when it was actually recorded ..

This is the same story in circulation for 20 years..

I understand why some mnml purest act the way they do..

if every genre or let me be policitally correct (& sub-genre)
perpetuates this it will continue to manifest.. I couldn't agree more with the barriers that some how restrict people from being comfortable......I just can't stand another round of hearing the same things over and over… about the same things guys of yesterday... again and again and again. as if people at the water cooler on monday should be still talking about this, innovative, glorified, self- rigorous, pretensions, marketing attempted, ploys with stories and now people are view as troops..to go out and demand people vote for in a particular way....

I’m sorry I just don’t respond well to this nor have I ever… nor hope I ever will. If I wanted that I would have joined the service.

you know as well as I do you mnml is tiny and more or less non profit. and post about juan atkins doing something with a commerical pop hip hop artist which will make him more millions.. I just don't get.

You can perpetuate anything you want. the specific count was not important iwas that you were saying it's just (in the box) kinda of a thing and that it was all uniform / as your military post. I’m a silly ass and I can’t even complete a track. I’m all washed up and retired.. I’m selling my computer but I’m taking my mind with me..

and YES I agree they were (juan /friends) are innovators. was that ever my argument? So I don’t understand all the attempts to say he/they were… of course they were they are legends of it’s self. Always and forever… no questions never any doubt or confusion.

I'm just saying (in my opinion) the music has had its twist and turns however to me it more or less stayed at a consistent level.. (sure you had cross genres but nothing really new with the music itself).. and until the artist mentioned took what was there for 20 years and then set and entirely new bar... yes call me blue I think of them an innovators..


entirely new bar... meaning no way back now as in computers were to us for the first time... and the internet... that is and/will be perhaps looked upon in 20 years that perhaps has waited for..

Innovator.
in•no•vate ( P ) Pronunciation Key (n-vt)
v. in•no•vat•ed, in•no•vat•ing, in•no•vates
v. tr.
To begin or introduce (something new) for or as if for the first time.

so I will argue this until the sun comes up..

to even take it a step further any dj the presents two tracks together is innovate by definition....

This has gone into the waters of getting personal.

Bottom-line: we all have opinions. You can state yours, I'll state mind. but I'm not telling MY opinion to you like it SHOULD be yours.. I think when you speak you talk to people including myself as if I HAVE to see your side and or as if you explored every possible avenue in the entire world and then came to a conclusion. Meaning when you speak its as if you speak as if your word is law… ..

I personally believe everyone on this board is innovative and every soul is an artist..

I felt offended after reading the post............perhaps if I knew the guy I may have understood..

I understand the point but not this type of purpose to hold on to that one guy when that first cross was made.. well bridges have been built since then...

Recap: sure let's get Juan paid..(More) paying an artist is what's it's all about. I mean no disrespect to anything you guys are doing what needs to be done and I could go without saying they may have wrote the business bible to getting an artist paid.. I'll just be formal to remove all doubt.

This entire conversation came from tone in which I felt after reading it..

(I felt) they were demanding emails to vote and continue to call someone an innovator ... again ... and... well again.. and again.. I thought that was already covered? Sure new media will sooner or later catch up always and forever but does this valid sending crude emails of demand?

I mean we are not still trying to push for (more) paychecks for the guy who invented the microwave?

case in point:
I'm making light of the attachment people have with words such as (innovative) as if you can only do it once and no one else is allowed to be innovative.. and also.. why is a personal email to a friend being posted on multiple forums cliff? of course people are going to take it out of context.. ?


someone that well off I can't imagine he feels left out..? I appricate the agressive movement concept. the warrier mentality.

perhaps UR should take a huge project on and work with all of the above artists and get the (new and the old) innovator’s paid like business innnovator mike himself..

You are the gatekeeper..

[dsat]

your english reads like a google translation
lol