How to sound better in mono?

damagedgoods · Post by **damagedgoods** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 10:44 pm

never use panning to resolve issues with your mixdown. make sure everything fits nicely in mono and *then* worry about stereo field placement. if everything doesn't fit nicely in mono, you've still got work to do.

Stomper · Post by **Stomper** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 10:57 pm

Toloache wrote:
there is no specific way.
it depends on what problems occurs when you sum it to mono.

of course it wont sound as open when compared to stereo, but what else happens when you sum it to mono?
Well i know this is dumb but.. things sound too mono lol

I mean i can hear all the different sound, but they obviously become less clear because there is some overlapping of frequencies.. You cant hear all that fancy mid side and left right eq and from what i understand, panning translate only in -level when summed to mono.

So i was wondering if there is some other tecnique to maintain the stereo illusion even when summed. For example i know we can give the illusion of stereo even with pan center delaying and equing the L or R channel of a sound but this also doesnt translate well to mono.

i suppose the only way to avoid mud and overlapping is arrangement then?

why are you summing to mono?
I believe it's best to sound good in stereo and also in mono to ensure maximum compatibility. Indeed there are PA that still use only mono!

dual mono compressor is one way.
the only plugins i know that has this feature are some of the UAD ones, but i havent been on the market for a new compressor for a long time.
if you dont find one, you can bounce your stereo track to left and right mono tracks.
slightly different compression on each side gives the illusion of much wider stereo. one side has fast release compared to the other one, one has higher ration but lower treshold. i play with it so each has different setting but will compress about the same amount of db (usually i play around 4-5db). use it on pads, fxs and or anything you want which is not the focus of the track (not on drums or melody or something like that).
if you use sends than put all reverbs in a group and use this technique. its awesome and brings so much life to track.

another thing is your source. i remember when i just started and only used samples i also had these kind of issues. but these day i make the sound on my own and the fix most times is a filter tweak away.
if you are using samples, you should listen to damagedgoods. it will be much easier to pick and edit samples to sound good to begin with than try to fix it later on.

EDIT: actually, listen to him even if your not using samples

tone-def · Post by **tone-def** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:10 am

damagedgoods is right. i probably don't worry about it sounding good in mono because i never pan anything until i've got all the sounds in place. i try not having sounds in the same frequency band playing at the same time.

hydrogen · Post by **hydrogen** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:46 am

Dunno, panning is pretty crucial for a great stereo mix. I think checking it in mono is a great idea, either by summing to mono on master buss, listening to only left channel on both speakers and listening to right channel on both speakers. All valid things to check towered the end of a session.

RichardLodge · Post by **RichardLodge** » Sat May 07, 2011 3:16 pm

I think generally a mono tracks never going to sound as good as a stereo track.. just the way we listen to music.

You should maybe try referencing your mono track against a track you like that's also in mono. Or try taking a reference track and switching between mono and stereo to see how it changes. You might find that in comparison your track sounds fine.

+1 about clashing frequency ranges.. very important specially in mono.

Also most clubs do use mono systems, if it were in stereo only about 1% of the people there would be in the right position to hear the spread. Ever been to a club and ended up standing right next to a speaker... that's not going to sound good in stereo is it. In fact a lot of the music we hear (apart from headphones) is effectively mono, once you get a relative distance away from the sound source our ears can no longer distinguish between which is left and which is right.. so mono.

The idea of suggesting a stereo spread in mono - I understand what your getting at, as you say if you have a mono sound you can artificially make it stereo, but only if its played out in stereo. If your summing to mono there is no way you can suggest stereo.. totally impossible. You can create depth.. using reverb to place things at the back of the mix and compression to bring things forward but if its in mono there is no left and right.. just centre.

blizt · Post by **blizt** » Sat May 07, 2011 5:33 pm

damagedgoods wrote:never use panning to resolve issues with your mixdown. make sure everything fits nicely in mono and *then* worry about stereo field placement. if everything doesn't fit nicely in mono, you've still got work to do.

Is that advice for real? Im far away from being an expert but I always thought panning was key to achieve the perfect mixdown where everything sits in place and can be heard clearly.

hydrogen · Post by **hydrogen** » Sat May 07, 2011 6:22 pm

blizt wrote:
damagedgoods wrote:never use panning to resolve issues with your mixdown. make sure everything fits nicely in mono and *then* worry about stereo field placement. if everything doesn't fit nicely in mono, you've still got work to do.
Is that advice for real? Im far away from being an expert but I always thought panning was key to achieve the perfect mixdown where everything sits in place and can be heard clearly.

Check your mix in mono, if you notice frequencies are phasing/distorting... fix those too... but DON'T leave panning to the last step. When you are making a STEREO mix. panning should be second on your list next to setting the levels.

If you wait to pan as your last step, you'll have carved so much out of your sounds that you'll want to put stuff back in to compensate. Another side effect is that you'll never get used to the panning after you've been hearing something mono for so long.

I can tell you I have mixed this way without panning for many years and my music has always suffered because of it. My music is extremely mono and extremely two dimensional... All this time about panning, i refused to start in my mix because i the moment i panned i'd be like that sounds weird or its quieter because its only coming out of one speaker. So I'd just try to keep everything without any stereo stereo placement.

I'm still getting over this... I sometimes have to force myself and Pan the levels to what I know is good. Turn off the music reset my ears, leave the room and delete a preconceived notion of how it "should" or "used to" sound and then listen again. For once, I finally have some dimension in my music. Thank you Alan Blumlein for stereo.

Stomper · Post by **Stomper** » Sun May 08, 2011 9:47 am

hydrogen wrote:I'm still getting over this... I sometimes have to force myself and Pan the levels to what I know is good. Turn off the music reset my ears, leave the room and delete a preconceived notion of how it "should" or "used to" sound and then listen again. For once, I finally have some dimension in my music. Thank you Alan Blumlein for stereo.

have you tried to sum to mono after panning?
i pan it without listening than if its sound weird i sum it to mono and back for a minute or two until i realize it sounds more open and not weird.
i do this before i do any eqing/filtering.