Dapayk talks about minus/hawtin
With contakt their aim was to reach the people who had never heard of M_Nus or Richie. How else are you would they have been able to sell out world wide. DjMag gave Rich a top 20 position this year which further supports my theory that M_Nus is in for the long run and taking cocoon along for the ride. In that respect I think their strategy worked pretty well for them.
-
BeatBoxBaby
- mnml maxi
- Posts: 685
- Joined: Fri May 18, 2007 10:10 am
- Location: Budapest, Hungary
I don't like the Cocoon "sound" itself. I mean their releases. I feel it cold and distant, and perhaps even commercial. I believe it's more popular with big crowds and big-name Djs (apart from m_nus and category) than m_nus (and likes) for example. Although I do acknowledge Sven's earlier productions (same old story as with Richie maybe). For example "The Harlequin - The Robot and the Ballet Dancer (1994)" is definitely a unique and outstanding production in electronic music. I once listened to parts of a Sven Vath dj set about 2 years ago, I've seen some tracklists of his sets in the time being, but never listened to any again, and I don't think this will change. He's funny with his fooling around though (making a clown of himself).Celltek wrote:With contakt their aim was to reach the people who had never heard of M_Nus or Richie. How else are you would they have been able to sell out world wide. DjMag gave Rich a top 20 position this year which further supports my theory that M_Nus is in for the long run and taking cocoon along for the ride. In that respect I think their strategy worked pretty well for them.
From Cocoon, as a Dj I love Ricardo though. His style is totally different. With a good friend of mine, with whom we share our tastes in music 100%, we concluded that Ricardo "remains" with Cocoon for the great promo in Ibiza. (We might be wrong though.)
It's okay if m_nus takes Cocoon along for a ride, I just really hope they don't start taking up Cocoon sound!
In that same discussion we also concluded that "Richie and Sven Vath are DISCO INVADERS" (and we didn't mean that in positive terms)!
Few weeks later I received this mail from Beatport:
.
...:::I Looove this Place:::...
well maybe u have noticed that the minus releases havent increased in quality at all and the originality they had wih their sound has been copied to death by now + they all seem unable to innovate themselfs again, wich is IMO necessary to survive as a long time quality label.BeatBoxBaby wrote:Yes, the marketing work is good for them of course, cause they need to sell themselves... it's a cruel world after all.Petar wrote:superfancy marketing works good for them
My point is, that apart from marketing, they do continue to provide quality and outstanding music. All the marketing and commercial work they do is not at the loss of quality productions. In many cases commercialization takes back on quality... you know when catchy, cute vocals come in, to make a song more marketable for the dance scene and 17 year old party-goers. Minus stayed underground! (Well... their marketing work didn't, but music is what counts.)
... and now if I think of it, apart from Niederflur's Sülzgurtel, and Troy's Girl Down by the River, no other minus release comes into mind with any vocals really...
Don't misunderstand me... there are good vocals of course. Like Shadi Megallaa, Daze Maxim or Dapayk with Eva Padberg, that type. No problem with those!
on the other hand their events are still drawing more and more people, including lots of ppl u dont want there and their PR is just getting bigger and more over the top with every new idea they have . i think u can imagine yourself that people who just love music and used to love minus for their originality are not really happy with that progression....
for cocoon its another story, it was quite clear from the beginning that this was a more mainstream label and they never tried to deny that , it was svens idea from the beginning to bring 'low accessible quality electronic music' to as much people as possible. as sven is a bigroom dj pur sang i dont see anything wrong with that.
Interesting points. I have three questions for you..laurens wrote:well maybe u have noticed that the minus releases havent increased in quality at all and the originality they had wih their sound has been copied to death by now + they all seem unable to innovate themselfs again, wich is IMO necessary to survive as a long time quality label.BeatBoxBaby wrote:Yes, the marketing work is good for them of course, cause they need to sell themselves... it's a cruel world after all.Petar wrote:superfancy marketing works good for them
My point is, that apart from marketing, they do continue to provide quality and outstanding music. All the marketing and commercial work they do is not at the loss of quality productions. In many cases commercialization takes back on quality... you know when catchy, cute vocals come in, to make a song more marketable for the dance scene and 17 year old party-goers. Minus stayed underground! (Well... their marketing work didn't, but music is what counts.)
... and now if I think of it, apart from Niederflur's Sülzgurtel, and Troy's Girl Down by the River, no other minus release comes into mind with any vocals really...
Don't misunderstand me... there are good vocals of course. Like Shadi Megallaa, Daze Maxim or Dapayk with Eva Padberg, that type. No problem with those!
Which label has "increased quality" and originality so much more that brings you to the conclusion that M-nus's output is stagnant.
If M_Nus is truly the devil and their music is lame, why would people bother copying it?
Which label do you perceive to be innovating at this moment?
[/quote]
Interesting points. I have three questions for you..
Which label has "increased quality" and originality so much more that brings you to the conclusion that M-nus's output is stagnant.
If M_Nus is truly the devil and their music is lame, why would people bother copying it?
Which label do you perceive to be innovating at this moment?[/quote]
maybe not increasing but being more consequent are in my eyes mobilee, ostgut, cecille, hello?repeat, stock, spectral and probably a lot more that dont come to my mind at this point. (i dont wanna make this a discussion about music knowledge) .
the main difference is that those labels just bring quality music and dont come up with cubes and invaders ,.... to make as much possible money out of it while as minus' releases are not consequent in quality, they get worse in my opinion (but thats personal ofc) and just get more and more commercial in their PR for the money and to get as much attention as possible.
why people copied it? because it was good when they started and minus was new and fresh and their 'one big family' feel pulled a lot of followers. but that doesnt applie to minus anymore imo.
dont get me wrong, some artists on minus still do great things, like troy pierce or audion but for example: at i love techno troy played exactly 15 minutes and marc houle was just fancyfare music but played for an hour or more. the contakt event, presented as a hightech experience had a terrible soundsystem with zero midtones , yet the room was stacked all night long and the cube didnt work,. on the next contakt event the room will be stacked again, it will be pover quality AGAIN but send enough ritchies in spacesuit over the internet and the rooms will keep being stacked. the amount of real musiclovers in that crowd keeps decreasing tho and i find it hard to accept that someone who presents himself as an artist can be happy with that...
Interesting points. I have three questions for you..
Which label has "increased quality" and originality so much more that brings you to the conclusion that M-nus's output is stagnant.
If M_Nus is truly the devil and their music is lame, why would people bother copying it?
Which label do you perceive to be innovating at this moment?[/quote]
maybe not increasing but being more consequent are in my eyes mobilee, ostgut, cecille, hello?repeat, stock, spectral and probably a lot more that dont come to my mind at this point. (i dont wanna make this a discussion about music knowledge) .
the main difference is that those labels just bring quality music and dont come up with cubes and invaders ,.... to make as much possible money out of it while as minus' releases are not consequent in quality, they get worse in my opinion (but thats personal ofc) and just get more and more commercial in their PR for the money and to get as much attention as possible.
why people copied it? because it was good when they started and minus was new and fresh and their 'one big family' feel pulled a lot of followers. but that doesnt applie to minus anymore imo.
dont get me wrong, some artists on minus still do great things, like troy pierce or audion but for example: at i love techno troy played exactly 15 minutes and marc houle was just fancyfare music but played for an hour or more. the contakt event, presented as a hightech experience had a terrible soundsystem with zero midtones , yet the room was stacked all night long and the cube didnt work,. on the next contakt event the room will be stacked again, it will be pover quality AGAIN but send enough ritchies in spacesuit over the internet and the rooms will keep being stacked. the amount of real musiclovers in that crowd keeps decreasing tho and i find it hard to accept that someone who presents himself as an artist can be happy with that...
well that is called business baby 
according to hawtin , the business of selling tracks is dead with all the illegal downloading, and that is true... So he believes in making money on venues. People can't spent 2$ on a track , or 10$ on an album , but are ready to pay 20 bucks to see a show , so why bother making good tracks again when you already got some fame.
Some djs that are booked all around the world have made only 1 hit and they can ask 9000$ per gig , so why botherwasting time in studio? there is so much tracks available ...
according to hawtin , the business of selling tracks is dead with all the illegal downloading, and that is true... So he believes in making money on venues. People can't spent 2$ on a track , or 10$ on an album , but are ready to pay 20 bucks to see a show , so why bother making good tracks again when you already got some fame.
Some djs that are booked all around the world have made only 1 hit and they can ask 9000$ per gig , so why botherwasting time in studio? there is so much tracks available ...
how about enjoying and making 'edit: and bringing' music (or a dj set) instead of trying to get rich of something, go sell cars if thats ur goal but dont present yourself as an artist . its nice to get some financial recognition for what u do but that should never be the main purpose of an 'artistic label' .if i recall correctly ritchie RICH hawtin profiled himself and the label as a true underground platform when he made de-9 and started with minus, something to release his experiments on, where is the experiment in minus now if i may ask?camus wrote:well that is called business baby
according to hawtin , the business of selling tracks is dead with all the illegal downloading, and that is true... So he believes in making money on venues. People can't spent 2$ on a track , or 10$ on an album , but are ready to pay 20 bucks to see a show , so why bother making good tracks again when you already got some fame.
Some djs that are booked all around the world have made only 1 hit and they can ask 9000$ per gig , so why botherwasting time in studio? there is so much tracks available ...
-
thomasjaldemark
- mnml maxi
- Posts: 2675
- Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 1:29 pm
- Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
- Contact:
The Plastikman album Closer had vocals, but in a good way.BeatBoxBaby wrote:Petar wrote: In many cases commercialization takes back on quality... you know when catchy, cute vocals come in, to make a song more marketable for the dance scene and 17 year old party-goers. Minus stayed underground! (Well... their marketing work didn't, but music is what counts.)
... and now if I think of it, apart from Niederflur's Sülzgurtel, and Troy's Girl Down by the River, no other minus release comes into mind with any vocals really...
But about catchy, cute vocals....
What about R U OK? Techno Vocals?
