what Drum Machines are these beats from(Burnski, Azari&III)?

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shubelo
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what Drum Machines are these beats from(Burnski, Azari&III)?

Post by shubelo » Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:23 am

Hey guys, Can anyone hear what drum machine these drum samples are originally from? Both tracks have the same sounding drum samples. Kick,snare,clap (is the clap layered) ,hat ( I love the sound of them been played together). My guess is the 808, but I couldn't find them in any of my packs? Is there a chance anyone can supply them from what they have, would point out something?

Both from start:




I drifting away from using the random drum sample pack that come in pack, instead just using dedicated drum machine pack for the main patterns e.g 808,707,emu etc. But I find them clean and lacking any punch or beef, the beats sound a little week, I've added some tape emulation and layered them with some dirty samples to get some texture but I find their still not heavy enough. Ive got the Alchemy and goldbaby packs

What do you guys use to get these drum machine samples rocking?

eggnchips
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Re: what Drum Machines are these beats from(Burnski, Azari&I

Post by eggnchips » Sat Mar 16, 2013 8:07 am

Hello

If you are using the Goldbaby and Alchemy 909 and 808 samples then there should be no problem as they are quality samples, and those sample packs are used by lots of established producers.
Maybe you are working the samples too much to get a result when they should be left simply as they are. Concentrate on the groove in the sequencing and avoid cluttering up your patterns with too many drum samples.
If you are after a pure 909 sound then I know the Goldbaby samples don't need any dirtying up any more as they were recorded using tape machines, slightly overdriven, and those example tracks you used just sound like similar 909 sounds.

You should post up some of your music so maybe we can listen in and give our opinions.

shubelo
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Re: what Drum Machines are these beats from(Burnski, Azari&I

Post by shubelo » Sat Mar 16, 2013 9:13 am

eggnchips wrote:Hello

If you are using the Goldbaby and Alchemy 909 and 808 samples then there should be no problem as they are quality samples, and those sample packs are used by lots of established producers.
Maybe you are working the samples too much to get a result when they should be left simply as they are. Concentrate on the groove in the sequencing and avoid cluttering up your patterns with to many drum samples.
If you are after a pure 909 sound then I know the Goldbaby samples don't need any dirtying up any more as they were recorded using tape machines, slightly overdriven, and those example tracks you used just sound like similar 909 sounds.

You should post up some of your music so maybe we can listen in and give our opinions.
Thanks mate, yeah Im slowly figuring out these samples don't need to many surgical effects just like to get them all sounding like one overall mix and beefy, Do you have any of these sample pack. Because maybe you will hear something I cant or know what samples to pitch. I just cant hear anything in there, there are some close samples but Im sure someone can hear these exact samples somewhere?

I found this. They used the same drums again.


I don't really have any "tunes" per say where Ive only used drum machine samples but heres something I come up with last night.



AK
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Re: what Drum Machines are these beats from(Burnski, Azari&I

Post by AK » Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:35 am

Kick and snare in all 3 are 909 sounds. I'm not sure about the clap, doesn't sound 909 to me and neither do the hats but hats can be filtered to high heaven so could start out as different to how they sound on those tracks. There's a clave in the last track and the 909 doesn't have a clave. If all the drums were coming off a single drum machine, I'd be more inclined to think they were using a Jomox rather than a 909 because of the additional clap/hat/clave sounds that do not sound like your typical 909 but yeah, then again, they could be using samples because of the almost static similarity across all 3 tracks ( which could be deliberate or not )

I personally cannot tell if someone uses a 909 live or 909 samples but anyway, that's what the kick and snare sounds originate from. The clap sound is pretty generic so shouldn't be difficult to achieve. The rest is in your programming and production. A lot of people tend to use the 909 kick and snare without too much processing as it sounds good right off the bat, although there's probably compression going on and maybe some eq but who knows?

A good raw sample library of a 909 coupled with a few additional sounds would be all you need and it seems you have that with the packs you describe, your programming/groove/velocities and any subsequent subtle processing should take care of the rest. You could seek out some Jomox drum machine samples too, would be worth a look. I have 909 samples as well as the Jomox Airbase, the Jomox MBase and Jomox XBase 999, I'd be happy to share those but unfortunately, I use a USB dongle for Internet and it's snail pace so uploading audio samples wouldn't be a wise idea :)


Here's the Jomox XBase 999, I'm sure there's samples around from this : http://www.jomox.de/product_details.php ... oduct_id=1

shubelo
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Re: what Drum Machines are these beats from(Burnski, Azari&I

Post by shubelo » Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:01 pm

AK wrote:Kick and snare in all 3 are 909 sounds. I'm not sure about the clap, doesn't sound 909 to me and neither do the hats but hats can be filtered to high heaven so could start out as different to how they sound on those tracks. There's a clave in the last track and the 909 doesn't have a clave. If all the drums were coming off a single drum machine, I'd be more inclined to think they were using a Jomox rather than a 909 because of the additional clap/hat/clave sounds that do not sound like your typical 909 but yeah, then again, they could be using samples because of the almost static similarity across all 3 tracks ( which could be deliberate or not )

I personally cannot tell if someone uses a 909 live or 909 samples but anyway, that's what the kick and snare sounds originate from. The clap sound is pretty generic so shouldn't be difficult to achieve. The rest is in your programming and production. A lot of people tend to use the 909 kick and snare without too much processing as it sounds good right off the bat, although there's probably compression going on and maybe some eq but who knows?

A good raw sample library of a 909 coupled with a few additional sounds would be all you need and it seems you have that with the packs you describe, your programming/groove/velocities and any subsequent subtle processing should take care of the rest. You could seek out some Jomox drum machine samples too, would be worth a look. I have 909 samples as well as the Jomox Airbase, the Jomox MBase and Jomox XBase 999, I'd be happy to share those but unfortunately, I use a USB dongle for Internet and it's snail pace so uploading audio samples wouldn't be a wise idea :)


Here's the Jomox XBase 999, I'm sure there's samples around from this : http://www.jomox.de/product_details.php ... oduct_id=1
I really want to make a real go at getting to know these machines and using the sounds in productions, rather then just using random samples from all the "commercial" packs I have. I just cant find my ear for it in some instances. For example all the 909 kicks I try out all sound "clicky" and the bottom end seems to roll on forever. Im not trying to make the traditional style of Hip hop or early techno so I find it some help with cutting the decay and EQ a HPF around 100hz just clears it up and makes it easier to mix. I found this short tutorial helped




But I still think its not chunky enough in all my tracks. Like that example of my production in my last post I still had to layer it with a non traditional kick from a samples pack to get it to fill out and give some umphh.

Yeah I also have some random Jomox XBase 999 samples in one of the Holdbaby's but nothing that I can hear is what these hats or claps are going on. Frustrating now

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Re: what Drum Machines are these beats from(Burnski, Azari&I

Post by ray parry » Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:49 pm

a high pass filter at 130hz on a kick drum???? errr no i dont think so.

look the goldbaby samples are all you need. if you cant make good drums with them you need to continue trying rather then giving up. those drums are so phat you dont need to use any sort of processing.

AK
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Re: what Drum Machines are these beats from(Burnski, Azari&I

Post by AK » Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:59 pm

Maybe your frustrations lie not with the drum sounds themselves but with the drums functioning as a kit on the whole?

There are various things you can do to your drum kit that makes them feel like they are all of the same kit rather than a collection of random sampled put together.

1. Tuning of the individual drum sounds
2. Obviously the programming of your rhythms
3. Processing the kit as a whole

Some drum sounds do carry a definable sense of pitch, not only should you be aware of this in the context of your track and the music but also the pitch relationships between the individual drum sounds themselves. For instance, some Tom sounds ( esp the 808 variety ) can be pitched to certain chromatic intervals as they carry an obvious sense of pitch, some acoustic type Toms are a bit less pitch definable but can still be tuned against each other so they function well within the kit, you can tune these to 3rds and 4ths and 5ths, think of the nursery rhyme '3 blind mice' when tuning Toms against each other.

Kicks and Snares are like polar opposites, even if both carry no sense of obvious pitch, you can still find the 'question and answer' relationship between them by adjusting the fine tune of each. By question and answer, I refer to a common theme with drums and percussion which you will hear all over the place in various rhythms. One drum 'asks a question' and another drum sound 'answers it'. It's basically a kind of subconscious harmonic or frequency related relationship and is a key factor in creating natural and effective rhythms. You can apply the same technique with things like congas. A simple conga pattern can be seen like the kick and snare, polar opposites but obviously often syncopated between the kick and snare - obviously a lot more technical stuff to that with open and muted congas but there's an underlying principle which works to achieving effecting rhythms.

Subtle processing on the kit as a whole can often 'gel' it together and 'smear' the source sounds into a single sonic place where they will feel more like a kit rather than random individual sounds beamed in off various sources and for this reason, if you're going for that, dry raw sounds are ideal. I'm not necessarily talking about compression but other things are available too, esp. those that add a bit of colour or character to the kit.

Those are some of the main things that spring to mind for me for getting drums to work together, I use samples and synthesis and it's pretty much an absolute must to do these things or I'm just not feeling it all sit together.

I don't get what you mean by a decay being too long or whatever. You just put an envelope on your sounds to shape them how you want, in fact, I always prefer having source samples at maximum decay because it gives me more flexibility. If I have a short click for a kick, I can't effectively make it longer, whereas if I have a long decay tail, I have room to sculpt the sound how I see fit.

:)

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Re: what Drum Machines are these beats from(Burnski, Azari&I

Post by steevio » Sat Mar 16, 2013 6:33 pm

tbh the drums on those three tracks sound like a disjointed mix of different samples, they dont sound like one drum machine.

they could do with a bit of what AK is talking about

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