Polyrhythms..

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Atheory
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Post by Atheory » Fri May 01, 2009 11:21 am

mazee wrote:I'm not really sure what the rules are on whether I should be bumping this old thread or starting a new one...

But anyway, I'm just beginning to delve into polyrhythm by reading some of these older threads, and I have a quick question that relates to the conversation here. Am I right in saying that technically you could have a 4/4 "standard" beat with kicks and snares in all their usual boring places, but layer over 6/8 (or whatever) percussion loops? Wouldn't this be a good way to keep the ordinary "dancable" beat going whilst exploring the more interesting possibilities of polyrhythm?

Or have I got the whole idea of polyrhythm wrong? I'm self taught in all aspects of music, so I have some trouble understanding this stuff.
no, your completely right. if you had the kick going on 4/4 and a hat going 6/8 then it would be a 6 against 4 polyrhythm.

Martian Telecom
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Post by Martian Telecom » Fri May 01, 2009 5:52 pm

1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2
1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 1
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4

steevio
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Post by steevio » Sat May 02, 2009 12:00 am

Martian Telecom wrote:1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2
1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 1
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4
thats not polyrhythmic bro, thats 4/4

livecollective
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Post by livecollective » Sat May 02, 2009 1:59 am

1 2 | 1 2 3 | 1 2 | 1 2 3 4 | 1 2 | 1 2 3 | 1 2 | 1 2 3 4

Martian Telecom
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Post by Martian Telecom » Sat May 02, 2009 3:35 am

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyrhythm

You have been making music for how long and you don't recognize polyrhythm when you see it?

2/4
3/4
4/4
5/4
6/4

Polyrhythm is what happens when you play several meters at once. Time signature changes are not polyrhythm.

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Post by steevio » Sat May 02, 2009 12:14 pm

Martian Telecom wrote:
You have been making music for how long and you don't recognize polyrhythm when you see it?
i'll ignore that, your diagram does not represent polyrhythm.

try this for size;

1 - - 2 - - 3 - - 4 - - 1 - - 2 - - 3 - - 4 - -1
1 - - - 2 - - - 3 - - - 1 - - - 2 - - - 3 - - - 1

Atheory
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Post by Atheory » Sat May 02, 2009 12:38 pm

Martian Telecom wrote: 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2 - 1 - 2
1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 1
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 1
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 4
i think what you posted is wrong and misleading in a discussion about polyrhythms for 2 reasons.

1)the string of numbers there, everything falls on the same beat or pulse. thats not polyrhythm. if everything falls on the same beat (ie even your 1-6 cycle are all falling on a 1 or a 2. so this doesn't work. the contrast between notes isn't there, so it wouldn't be felt or heard.

2)your 1-6 cycle and 1-5 cycle aren't completed.

i don't know if its that you don't understand time signatures or you don't understand polyr's or maybe both.

maybe this will be helpful.

one simple example is say a 3 against 5 polyr.....

3 x 5 = 15....so there will be 15 pulses or spaces for a beat. in a 16step sequencer the last one is cut off or not used. so.....

0 x x 0 x x 0 x x 0 x x 0 x x
0 x x x x 0 x x x x 0 x x x x

0=hit
x=rest

the notes don't fall on the same beat, creating interesting rhythmic combinations.

so you can do this for any two numbers. 7 against 6...42 pulses, with the 6 occuring every 6 pulses and the 7 every 7 pulses. sometimes they will hit on the same notes, sometimes not.

ok, hope that cleared it up a bit.

Atheory
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Post by Atheory » Sat May 02, 2009 12:42 pm

steevio wrote:
Martian Telecom wrote:
You have been making music for how long and you don't recognize polyrhythm when you see it?
i'll ignore that, your diagram does not represent polyrhythm.

try this for size;

1 - - 2 - - 3 - - 4 - - 1 - - 2 - - 3 - - 4 - -1
1 - - - 2 - - - 3 - - - 1 - - - 2 - - - 3 - - - 1
too quick for me steevio, too quick.

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