DJ ing with laptops

[steevio]

in the thread about sending demos, we went off at a tangent on the pros and cons of DJing vinyl/CDs etc. but i'm interested in what people think about DJing with laptops.
maybe this topic has already been visited, so apologies if so, just point me at the thread.

i DJ my own material with a laptop, usually in a very complex way, mixing 4 or 5 tracks at a time, and utilising outboard effects and analogue filters, and yet i still dont feel i'm truly performing.
i started out playing totally live with an all analogue set-up, but it got too scary taking my vintage synths and such on the road at the mercy of cavorting beer cans, and not least being stolen or damaged in transit.
but i really miss it.
so temporarily for the last couple of years i've been laptop based, but i'm building a new compact bullet proof flight-cased hardware system which i'm hoping to have up and running this summer.
what i'd like to know is, how do people feel about DJ's playing out other peoples tunes from a laptop ?
i know that personally i couldnt do it, it wouldnt feel right to me, but i suppose it depends on where you draw the line and how much creative input is coming from the DJ and which tools he is using to manipulate the mix and to what extent.
how do you feel about it ?
is it killing the art of DJing or is it just the start of a new form of musicianship which will soon become infinitely more complex than spinning a couple of records together ?
i really dont know.

[oblioblioblio]

in my opinion, the latter. I see djing with a computer as a really valuable method of expression.

Personally, I use an Ableton set up of 6 channels with just filters on each, something which is really quite free and enjoyable. I have full access to every element of every track without needing to queue anything up or flick through cases, and in a split second I can try out a track, decide to use it or not, filter it down to just one tiny element, shift it forwards 2 beats, backwards 2 beats etc etc. This lets me treat the tracks in much the same way as an element in my own production, though thankfully lending itself to a slightly less self absorbed style of performance (for me I mean, I'm not knocking live performances generally here).

Also, I definitely don't want to knock mixing with vinyl here by highlighting the benefits (to me) of using digital. Vinyl is just as an expressive a medium, just with slightly different restrictions on performance. And interestingly enough this is often reflected in the tracks designed for the medium itself (i.e. a track released for vinyl has to 'be able to stand on it's own 2 feet' (to quote my mate), whereas a digital track can do whatever it likes and can still be useful to a dj.

To derail the thread slightly (if that's ok), I am moderately embarrassed by the fact that I used a large series of words gushing to steevio about the virtues of his live performance and of live performances generally , when in fact he was djing all along! heheh.

[STML]

Long time Vinyl DJ...

At first I was pretty uncomfortable with it. I tried Traktor, etc (the more traditional DJ apps) and just couldn't get comfortable with it. I've tried Serato, etc, and I just can't get into it.

Live on the other hand, is probably the least like traditional DJing. It was a little weird at first, but now I love it. It frees up so much time in a set to be creative, and to do it properly, with FX chains and multiple tracks, is something of a different output to traditional 2 deck or 3 deck mixing. Its really opened up the sound I get, and at least for me, personally, has really pushed the output I'm getting into the more creative, flowing, one piece of music as opposed to "mixing other peoples tunes".

I also think its plenty interactive if you set it up properly, with controllers. I think the key is to set a goal of not having to touch the laptop, and once you get near that, its really more like playing HW or something.

[hydrogen]

hardware or eliminate your computer monitor. only then will you be truly freed from the feeling of being locked in the digital controlled climate.

[STML]

I suppose this is pretty philosophical, but what is wrong, exactly, with being totally digital (beyond sound quality, and the joy of pure waves)?

I love my analog gear, but there is something to be said, imo, in embracing the medium...

It seem a lot of people I speak to are very adamant about being hardware/vinyl only, etc. As an adjunct to the original question, what is it that people are having a hard time with with the laptop format (for either DJing or live work)?

[ec50]

i suspect this discussion is going to end up in 2 camps like the synthesis vs sampling discussion...

my opinion is that the result is what is important (both for production and performance). as long as the sounds are good - im not bothered whether it is performed with vinyl, laptop, intruments, (combination of all), etc.

i know there are many people who place the emphasis on the process side of things - 'purists' - so be it - everyone has their preferences - none is superior

the 'art' in my opinion lies in 'creating the sound' - many different ways of doing/achieving this

[strider]

Oh my.. what can I say.. at least your open-minded and say its ok "but I rather prefer vinyl or digital" or viceversa.

But here (my country) everyone is only criticizing.
or complaining about
"Why is he using that?" (LivE)
**30 mins later **
"what software are you using?"
"is it VirtualDj, is it Traktor?"
"noup, its Ableton Live" now please step over and dont watch my tracks haha
**1 1/2 hour later**
"Ohh man I liked you mix, it was nice"


Yup my reality so I dont know why you should be ashamed or not being you just becuse your mixing tunes from a laptop.

While you're making me dance whether is laptop,vinyl,cds your synth or whatever.

I wont say anything and keep dancing. If that's the way you like to play and to transmit your feelings and energy to the ppl I will RESPECT that.

Greetings from El Salvador.

Strider.

My 0.02 cents

[tone-def]

I've always thought whats the point of dj-ing with a laptop when you can do so much more with it. If someones going to have a laptop on stage i would rather see them do something more creative than simply mixing one recorded into another.