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PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 9:12 pm 
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mnml maxi
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I am not saying that copyright infringement should somehow be considered freedom of speech... then again, what if you quoted a copyrighted phrase from a movie in a public speech like a wedding or a graduation speech... is that wrong? I will leave that for you to decide. Neither am denying that it is immoral to steal. If I had my copyrighted works being pirated I would probably react negatively too. I think that would stem from my sense of ownership. I think this is part of the reason why I like netlabel music so much and respect the producers. If you love it enough, let it fly away. Bask in the good karma and the knowledge that your existence created a positive and wider vibration in the course of the universe then it might have otherwise. Of course, the realities of the world intrude and when we are forced to face personal economic woes all these other issues come bubbling up.

What I am concerned about is not so much a matter of freedom of speech as it is an issue of freedom of expression. I find it interesting that so many people within the electronic music community draw this distinction between downloading an original unaltered copy of a digital track and a track that while mostly unaltered is overlayed with some other copyrighted work for certain parts. What that seems to communicate is that a greater value is placed on the expression of the individual (dj in this case) than the rights of the copyright holder. I can honestly say I have not met a single person that is against the distribution of copyrighted works in the form of a dj set, and that most people seem to think that an slightly altered copy is completely ok. I feel generally the same way but I am willing to admit that it is totally hypocritical. I do not deny it for a second. This is something to consider when you seek a position born of principle which most pro-copyright activists do. A position of principle requires an application of said principle to all situations one might encounter or else it it not a true 'principle'. (look up the word if you do not really understand it)

I can't help but feel there is a large disconnect between the laws of the land and the standards of society particularly in this regard.

Phase Ghost wrote:
I think everyone agrees that Hollywood or whoever shouldn't get a golden ticket to axe any site they want that has a snippet of a tune or a picture of an album or whatever. But, sites that blatantly exist to pirate material should be taken down and possibly prosecuted. That has nothing to do with freedom of speech at all.

But that is exactly what will happen. Just look at the recent uproar over UMG's take down of Youtube videos which they did not have copyright over but some of their artists appeared in the video. They took advantage of some tiny loophole in their agreement with YouTube to suppress the freedom of expression of others. If you give these people any power over content control they will abuse it to the maximum that the law will let them and beyond until they are stopped. Just talk to any lawyers you know... they will confirm that a law is just a rule and any manipulation of the rule is ok as long as it is within the scope of the rule. The problem is that while you might have ethics, well, lets just say that is not something that bothers some people and it is those people that you must consider first and foremost when considering powers which are endowed to people.

Everyone needs to stop looking at the pathetic amount of money they may pocket and start looking at the big picture of how life on this planet will play out.

Some thoughts...

http://betanews.com/2008/10/17/youtube-and-the-dmca-ten-years-of-takedowns/


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 9:47 pm 
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mnml maxi
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Themis wrote:
there should definitly be platforms and ways, to share anonymously opinions and also maybe files. but these platforms have to be kind of moderated, so that no one abuses this anonymity.

I totally agree but these two ideas are totally incompatible so you need to pick a side. All is free or what we choose is freedom...


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 4:05 am 
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mnml mdrtr
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for freedom of speech you dont need anonymity.
we are talking about USA and Europe not about some 3rd world countries, there maybe the internet has other functions and anonymity is important.

and again to be not anonym, doesnt mean every single fact about your life will be saved in some computer somewhere, it only means if the police wants to find you, they can.

its just like now in real life, very few people know me and im basically anonym to the police and state, but if i go in the street and shoot someone, the chances that im in prison one week later are 99%.

and thats the way it should be.

if freedom for you means that you can do what you want and not held responsible for it, then im sorry to crash your dream, you are not free now, and never will be as long as you live in a society.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:13 am 
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mnml maxi
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That is a very simplistic analysis. Besides, why do you draw a distinction between the 3rd world and ours? The third world probably makes up more than a third and practices spread. What goes on in the third world is actually the dominant modus operandi on the planet if you do not include China/India which are kind of an anomalies. We must set the standard and no less.

How can you champion anonymity in a third world county but deny it to your fellow citizens? Do you truly believe that your country will never do anything which is objectionable or something which your citizens may want speak out against without fear of reprisal? By the way... I am noting that you are from Austria...

Although we are diverging from the issue of copyright... Its really a question of principles. Anonymity is the path to honesty.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:23 pm 
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mnml mdrtr
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i draw the line at that point were opinions can get you killed, its definitly not the case in west europe. if it is someday, then anonymity will have its uses again, but right now its used 100% for filesharing and nothing else.

again, there is a place between total anonymity and a police state.
tell me what good did megaupload for society? what was the "honesty" that we now lack?
for me its a cost/benefit analysis, what was the benefit right now and in the last 10 years out of anonymity in west europe?

anonymity is an illusion, if a state really wants to crack down on its citizens, then they get controll of the local internet providers and your anonymity is gone, no megaupload can do a thing against it.

the real problem with internet is not its anonymity, the problem is that no law can reach the whole internet, every country has its own law, and some countrys care and some do not. thats why the biggest part of the internet is a lawless space.

in the US with the RICO law, the state can confiscate any data from any company in the US, if there is a terror suspicion. just do the same for big cases of copyright infrigment and the problem is gone.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:57 pm 
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mnml maxi
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Well there is certainly no anonymity on the internet in Canada. The government here is passing (or maybe has passed already) a law that forces ISPs to install equipment that allows the police to monitor and retrieve all of your internet usage without a warrant. I bet the concept tickles you pink.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 5:51 pm 
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mnml mdrtr
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yeah the concept is great, the only thing that is not great is when the law allows it to retrieve and monitor without permission of a jugde first.

and thats the problem right now with this legislations, that they try to ship around the judiciary (court) and cut the corner right to executive (police).

thats what you should fight against, and not for anonymity.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 3:21 am 
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mnml mdrtr
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http://rt.com/usa/news/iipa-ustr-copyright-report-415/ -urk

aah, push it. Push it good.

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Image we are all atomic and subatomic particles and we are all wireless...


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