Artists moving to Germany to better their art

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Der geile Ami
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Post by Der geile Ami »

minimal house wrote:Remember when Chicago and Detroit were the epi-center of house and techno music? Eventually the market became over saturated and hit a brick wall....thats when we found new markets in europe and everyone and their mother started moving over there for a piece of the action. And now most house is crap, and techno is now "scrantz"
However, you are talkign about a short piece of time. New York had and still has a much larger house scene. Germany had a ton of stuff happening before berlin became hte "it" city. The cocoon family is frankfurt and sven has always been there. It is similar for Kompakt and Cologne. Remember, Berlin had a wall up until 89. Before it came down there were acid parites in the west and since it came down, most party locations have been in the east. Detroit and Chicago also suffered from (imho) too much local influence and hte music had stricter purity. Who moved to detroit or chicago vs who came up from around there? The mixing of different backgrounds keeps the influences mixed up.

Were new european markets "found," or were they always there but under the radar of american media? Dance music has never been received well in america, but europeans love to celebrate. People have been traveling here for years.

Is minimalism jsut a fad? This board makes me think it is. Prog trance got too big and cheesy, so prog house had to make it more serious. That got too pretentious, so tech-house had to add some percussion. Then came ableton and the complete ease of downloading, and tons of hacks could mouse around, not apply themselves, and claim to be minimal, when they jsut werent trying. danbell dates well before the century change. Glass, Reich, and Cage date beforemost of us were born.

Of course, theres a ton of you that havent been to berlin, and say its a fad and minimal is all the same now, but you cant even get access to some of the music being produced and played here.
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minimal house
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Post by minimal house »

Der geile Ami wrote:However, you are talkign about a short piece of time. New York had and still has a much larger house scene.
I dont think it was a short piece of time. From 85-95, thousands upon thousands of records came out of chicago. Along with it came hundreds of well known djs, producers, labels and industry....FAR more than NYC imo.

Is minimalism jsut a fad? This board makes me think it is. Prog trance got too big and cheesy, so prog house had to make it more serious. That got too pretentious, so tech-house had to add some percussion. Then came ableton and the complete ease of downloading, and tons of hacks could mouse around, not apply themselves, and claim to be minimal, when they jsut werent trying. danbell dates well before the century change. Glass, Reich, and Cage date beforemost of us were born.
Chicago and Detroit had roughly 10 year go at it with house and techno....will "minimal" still be alive and kickin in 2010? My guess is no. IMO, alot of minimal is really just a new school form of techno and house. Instead of calling it house or techno we gave the name "minimal." Kind of like the same way "scrantz" is techno.

And yes, long over are the days of spending thousands of dollars, studying and building different combinations of keyboard synthesizers, samplers, sequencers, effects and in are the days of the all-in-one $400 package for your computer. :(


Sorry if im going off on a tangent...im bored, and work sucks. :lol:
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jpls
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Post by jpls »

i dont think minimal techno is a fad...what i do think is a fad is the idea
of referring all techno which isnt 'hard' as minimal. there are a lot of great
tracks coming out...but i do not find anything minimal about them...

this goes back to an old post of mine in which i stated my ideas on
anything even slightly conceptual as being tagged minimal...which gets
tricky. it seems that anything slower (or anything played by hawtin) is
automatically tagged with this genre.

the example: rainforest by mathew jonson on the minus comp.
i do not see much about this track that would assist me in saying
it was minimal. does this mean i do not like it? of course not...thats one
of my favorites.

i think a large amount of the conceptual problems fellow technophiles
deal with today stem from the confusion that arises when the word
"minimal" is applied to such a wide variety of sounds...and of course
the backlash the is present when a popular/good track is deemed
not minimal...only to fall within the ever growing amorphous genre
of "not hard" techno that is greatly popular...and for good reason.

techno always changes...it is in its nature to be progressive in such
ways. the one aspect i love about truely minimal techno is that it seems
to bypass this progression. certain minimal tracks will always sound
new and progressive no matter how old they are...simply for the reason
of lacking any real reference to a specific subgenre besides that of
minimal.

example: Subphunk on Hardtrax vol III(plus8 80)

this track could come out today or 10 years ago.

thats it. back to being cranky.
seth
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Post by seth »

Der geile Ami wrote:
minimal house wrote:Remember when Chicago and Detroit were the epi-center of house and techno music? Eventually the market became over saturated and hit a brick wall....thats when we found new markets in europe and everyone and their mother started moving over there for a piece of the action. And now most house is crap, and techno is now "scrantz"
However, you are talkign about a short piece of time. New York had and still has a much larger house scene. Germany had a ton of stuff happening before berlin became hte "it" city. The cocoon family is frankfurt and sven has always been there. It is similar for Kompakt and Cologne. Remember, Berlin had a wall up until 89. Before it came down there were acid parites in the west and since it came down, most party locations have been in the east. Detroit and Chicago also suffered from (imho) too much local influence and hte music had stricter purity. Who moved to detroit or chicago vs who came up from around there? The mixing of different backgrounds keeps the influences mixed up.

Were new european markets "found," or were they always there but under the radar of american media? Dance music has never been received well in america, but europeans love to celebrate. People have been traveling here for years.

Is minimalism jsut a fad? This board makes me think it is. Prog trance got too big and cheesy, so prog house had to make it more serious. That got too pretentious, so tech-house had to add some percussion. Then came ableton and the complete ease of downloading, and tons of hacks could mouse around, not apply themselves, and claim to be minimal, when they jsut werent trying. danbell dates well before the century change. Glass, Reich, and Cage date beforemost of us were born.

Of course, theres a ton of you that havent been to berlin, and say its a fad and minimal is all the same now, but you cant even get access to some of the music being produced and played here.
i vary much agree with you in many aspects. new york and germany have been doing this forever and chicago and detorit take so much credit. while other cities have played just as big of a role in the development of dnace caulture and minimal music. i also agree with your statements on the music that is being played in berlin compared to what people think berlin is. is minimal a fad. i think not, however the packageing of a lot of the techno scene is vary glam now and alway in a sense has been so. i do also belive that a lot of minimal techno that is comming out currently is boring and the stuff at the turn of the century was more fun. however ive turned back to minimal house and deep house that use minimal precussion. minimal techno in no just glich, or dubby or this clogen sound. minimal is so much more. omar s. it that minim techno . no yet it is minimal. synth which is detroiter mike huckaby is that glich no . i feel that outsider or people whom have not traveled to berlin have put too much of a focas on trendyness and made it into this place that its not. i truly feel whats going on there right now is far more streched outside of just techno. berlin is about art and expression and the freedoms to do so. and untill you go, you seriously have nothing to speek about it. because i full trust anyone who love techno loves berlin. in not to live but to visit. so american stop being so jaded, berlins super serious.
if thing don't progress, will the future truly come
Der geile Ami
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Post by Der geile Ami »

berliners are serious? Im a pretty serious guy, cuz this is more than a hobby or passion for me, i eat everyday because i help support this whole machine. I dont eat filet mignon, but i dont work for the man in any way. still, nobody here is worrying what americans on internet message boards are having to say. The people are prolly more worrying about money and how to get their next fix of whatever.

min house, 85-95 is not that long of a stretch. NY has been doing its thing before rick dee´s "disco duck." The paradise garage had a bit of history. Besides, theres 10 years after 85 that ny was still doing stuff. Was tehre a twilo, tunnel, palladium, sound factory, etc in chicago after 95? Cuz I think all might have been active at hte same time 95-97. NY has a shitload more house records recorded, only im sure most of them are of that terrible diva remix variety.

As far as techno in berlin goes, i think it can be browkn down into 3 types: techno (this is your hard sound which has not really changed), electro (80s rehash, alter ego stuff, non aggresive or bloopy), and minimal.

Much of what is dubbed minimal is just trance or progressive house. reverb is the hottest thing since it got its original overuse 5 years ago. james holden anyone? im not knocking what hes doing, but its not labeled very well.
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isa
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Post by isa »

Der geile Ami wrote:still, nobody here is worrying what americans on internet message boards are having to say. The people are prolly more worrying about money and how to get their next fix of whatever.
true...
Jesse Somfay
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Post by Jesse Somfay »

Der geile Ami wrote:Much of what is dubbed minimal is just trance or progressive house. reverb is the hottest thing since it got its original overuse 5 years ago. james holden anyone? im not knocking what hes doing, but its not labeled very well.
<off topic>

I don't think that genre matters for any artist as long as they make good music.

Viva la reverb!

</off topic>
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brianc
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Post by brianc »

Der geile Ami wrote:Much of what is dubbed minimal is just trance or progressive house. reverb is the hottest thing since it got its original overuse 5 years ago. james holden anyone? im not knocking what hes doing, but its not labeled very well.
I'm glad someone finally said it.

Not that I don't like Holden's (and others') stuff, I just don't think it's truly minimal. Which makes me wonder: has minimal just become the latest buzz word that everyone's chasing? There definitely still is a lot of minimal out there, but there's a ton of stuff lately that's been mis-labeled.
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