For Producers / Digital label owners starting out.

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soapz
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For Producers / Digital label owners starting out.

Post by soapz »

A bit of an odd post, but I know that many people like to moan that there is no money in selling music now blah blah blah and say they have to keep their day jobs (therefore giving them less time to master their art), and then other people say that they do it for the music and not for the money and are annoyed that they have to keep working to make ends meet... well..

Ive been living in Chiang Mai in north thailand for the last four months working on some stuff. Its the cheapest city Ive ever been to that has decent internet! Seriously, i was paying $60 a month, sharing with my girlfriend for a one bedroom place with a swimming pool, we spent around $1500 each over the whole four month period total and we were going out quite a bit.

Theres a big expat scene here, lots of artists, web designers, writers and other creative people from all over that are using the city to do their art or run their businesses online without having to worry about going to work or spending too much money while they are just starting out. It kind of reminds me of an early berlin before the prices went up,.

As I said, there are lots of creative people here. lots of meet ups with entrepreneurs and all the rest but Im finding a lack of producers and general music folk.

Anyway if anybody wants to quit their day job, stop moaning about money, live somewhere hot and cheap and just get their heads down and work on some tracks for a few months with no distractions - Ive found you a place :) Just don't expect any amazing parties here, you would have to wait until you have finished your tracks then move back to a more upto date city.

PS; before I start getting hit with all the sarcastic comments, I'm aware those who have children or gig regularly are not able to just pack up and go and may find this post amusing and easy to poke at. But those just starting out, maybe leaving uni and dreading having to get a 9-5 now they have to support themselves, I would have killed for info like this. I was led to believe EVERYBODY had to do the 9-5 thing until your DJ career kicked off, or people started loving your tracks. Trust me, working full time and trying to put full energy into music is hard.

I met a guy here who was trying to start a business in the uk for ages but he didnt have enough money to fund it unless he worked full time. So he would be working two full time jobs really. He moved to Thailand, for about 6 months i think, did everything he needed to do online, made more money in the Uk than he was spending in Thailand, and now he is going back to UK now he is doing well. Without moving he wouldnt have given himself the opportunity to work on his business and probably would have failed. I think the same can happen with producers who arent spending enough time on their tracks.

So anyway I'll stop waffling but it just annoys me when I here people moaning about things that can be changed. If your music doesn't sound how you want it to, you just need to work on it more. Too busy? Then change something!
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Re: For Producers / Digital label owners starting out.

Post by steevio »

i stayed in Chiang Mai for a few weeks once, Northern Thailand is beautiful, so no fun being poked from here.
i totally agree with you, but it doesnt necessarily have to be as drastic (it may be for some people) as moving to Thailand. I could level a similar argument about moving to Wales, Ive been living here for 13 years at about half the cost of living in the city where i was from, and about a third of the cost of living in London.

i think anyone who is serious about making electronic music or running a label digital or otherwise is insane for living in London, you're just working to pay the ridiculous rents. Everything can be done via the Internet.

although i do know some people who have benefitted from living in London, but they we'rent just starting out, they'd already got a foothold, and living in London just boosted their careers, with more gig offers etc..

And having kids shouldnt affect things either, i moved my kids to Wales, and theyve grown up in a much safer environment than if they'd stayed in the city.

Of course, it's not for everyone, some people like to be out clubbing and drinking all the time, and need the city buzz, but for me that 'buzz' is an illusion, the parties out in the sticks are more friendly and warm, you can dance without being bumped into every 10 seconds, take your own booze, and no security. If i really need to hit the city for a night out, i jump in my car and i'm there in 2 or 3 hours, and it makes it more special.
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Re: For Producers / Digital label owners starting out.

Post by oblioblioblio »

i just can't do the 9-5 thing. to me it's just prostitution of my self and all that I can achieve as a human being. but that's the life for sale in the Western world. There's absolutely enormous psychological pressure to put on the shackles of work, enslave and be enslaved, and if anyone dares to question that then they must be a fucking freak or something... get off my property!

Well, I'm still around and have food and can survive and the few times I've sold my soul were painful enough to make me not want to do that ever again.

If Thailand works for you, congrats! You worked out how to survive on your own terms and that's important. I would worry about live contact, and would feel a little weird making art for Westerners living somewhere else... I kinda feel like to heal the Western experience there is one level being a part of it allows some authenticity. But then what do I know?

But like you say, if it gives you the opportunity to master your craft and break the cycle where you need money but also need free time to do unpaid studio work, that's a fantastic thing.
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Re: For Producers / Digital label owners starting out.

Post by mr lee »

I missed the part about label owners starting out.... or did I just read too fast? (it happens)

If I understood right, what you are saying is that Thailand is a great place to go that is cheap and full of start-up potential? Amirite?

I think you are right to some degree, but honestly starting a digital label in todays world is not expensive. If you have enough money to afford good gear, you can start a label. In fact, starting a label is so easy most people forget about the music part and just go straight into creating a label.

My .02 on your post. Go out, be adventurous and stop living within the boundaries set by the immediate world around you. I think for some people that is incredibly difficult. Most people are tied to their day job and live paycheck to paycheck with no real way of getting out. Most people I know who are into music do it as a way to get their mind away from that place they are stuck in. A sort of "mental vacation", if you will.

I think what you are doing is fantastic. I'm actually on a work assignment in Sydney and it's changed my entire perception about music, culture, and is resetting my creative attitude. Even though Syd is super expensive, I understand what you are getting at, just know that most people can't do that.

cheers,
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soapz
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Re: For Producers / Digital label owners starting out.

Post by soapz »

mr lee wrote:I missed the part about label owners starting out.... or did I just read too fast? (it happens)

If I understood right, what you are saying is that Thailand is a great place to go that is cheap and full of start-up potential? Amirite?
Exactly, I guess I explained it the long way around. I had just read through a few posts of people explaining that there is no money in selling music now and how labels run on a loss all the time, so I thought this post would apply to both producers and label owners.

I guess the point is.. if you're living in London or the likes, you will need to have quite a few tracks released on a regular basis and a few gigs a month just to reach the level of income as some brainless office job. As much as everybody is doing it "just for the music", everybody is also trying to get to a stage where they can give up their job to do music full time. If you live in the more affordable places then you can skip that stage and spend as much time as you want on your music without feeling you have taken too much of a risk. This can only be a good thing and will always increase creativity and hopefully lessen the need with some people to make samey, sh1tty tracks for the sake of trying to sell a few records to survive. It brings it back to doing it for the purpose of art and inspiration, not money!
oblioblioblio wrote:,,would feel a little weird making art for Westerners living somewhere else... I kinda feel like to heal the Western experience there is one level being a part of it allows some authenticity
I know what you mean, but there are quite a few westerners here. We did a couple of parties last month and most of the people who came were westerners. Saying that though, there were quite a few Thai's showed up and I managed to get most of them dancing :) Anyway I don't think staying somewhere for six months then heading back isn't going to change the authenticity of your music. Its just an easy way of putting yourself into a position of full control of your life and not having to waste time trying to fit into some bullsh1t society you don't want to while costing you and arm and a leg to do so.
mr lee wrote:I think you are right to some degree, but honestly starting a digital label in todays world is not expensive.
This is what I thought. I don't understand these conversations about labels running on a loss coming from all the time. Maybe they have bad spending habits? Too many drugs? Too much money wasted on promoting when they should have been busy making better music?

Anyway thanks for your thoughts. I thought it was something best said in the open then people can take from it what they wish.
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soapz
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Re: For Producers / Digital label owners starting out.

Post by soapz »

mr lee wrote:Even though Syd is super expensive, I understand what you are getting at,
I was in Sydney last year and yes it was very expensive. Just to put things into perspective..

I did some full time work in sydney just through an agency for about three weeks. I was getting paid $21 per hour, which was pretty standard, that one hours work now pays for my rent for 10 days here. (I didn't pay tax in sydney as i was under the threshold)

Can you imagine how many tracks on Beatport somebody in Sydney would have to sell to make a living from it? When all his/her friends are bringing home $3000 a month from their from boring office jobs and they are selling tracks and making $1 or whatever per sale?

I guess thats a different conversation though so i'll leave it at that but I do find it fascinating. Music is the same price, more or less, wherever you buy it from. So for a Thai person to buy tracks from beatport they have to work 3 hours PER track!. A Sydney person can buy 7 tracks for every hour worked. I guess it makes sense to DJ and not sell music in australia!
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Re: For Producers / Digital label owners starting out.

Post by steevio »

i think what you're doing is super cool.

its worth remembering though that running a label is not really a viable living for the majoirity of us, whereas gigging as a DJ or live act is, as long as you've released enough material to have a decent profile.

to get to that point you have to have released some quality tunes that have been noticed, and if living in Thailand is the way to get yourself the time to write a bunch of tunes, then you've got it sorted mate.

good luck to you
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Re: For Producers / Digital label owners starting out.

Post by eggnchips »

Full respect to you.
A lot of people think it's hard to get up and up sticks but when you do it yourself, you realise don't you how easy it is to adapt into new situations and lifestyles. In the town I am from in the UK, people complain non stop about how sh!t it is but they will never have the courage to leave the place. It's like they are scared.
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