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stevėsto
mnml maxi
Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 544
Location: St. Petersburg, FL
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 Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:07 am Post subject: |
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what a great article, its nice when a writer can put into words exactly what a lot of us are thinking but no one has said.
i think one reason why there are trends in the dj sets out there, is because of the nature of djing itself: its hard to break unwritten rules such as beat matching one track to the next or playing music you did not create. it would be pretty damn hard to be a dj and not do those 2 things. so what room for creativity is there? thats all djing is ... mixing one song to the next, so naturally this breeds an environment of people who are not very creative.
another reason is the nature of a scene itself. the moment you are in a music scene you are already programming yourself in a certain style. my girlfriend took me to see a rock band she likes. this was my exposure to a scene i didnt knew existed ... a scene where people dont dance or move around much but rather just stand and stare at a band wailing away distorted guitar chords, vocals you cant understand, and just a lot of chaotic noise suited for someone on heroin. this scene has rules as far as dress is concerned, how the music is made, and attitude. it was awful music, but to these rock scenesters they love it because it caters to their rules of their music: must have electric guitar, drum kit, and a singer. actually when you think about its just electric guiar, they just want music that has this particular instrument.
im sure most will agree and preach that rules need to be broken, but these same people will turn right around and release techno track #45667. |
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omnipresence
mnml mmbr
Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 180
Location: Perth, WA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:21 am Post subject: |
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| blockup wrote: | | ...just a tongue-in-cheek observation that me and my compadre's started to notice throught the year... |
How is that much different to Sherburne's article? |
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primevil
mnml maxi
Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 771
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| Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 11:47 am Post subject: |
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| patrick bateman wrote: | | psherburne wrote: | but blockup, you've got a similar manifesto on combat 88 right here:
http://combat-88.blogspot.com/2008/06/i-play-house.html
So this is the year all the sht cnt boring minimal by numbers DJ's in London jumped ship and started playing 'House' music, but as most of them have no groundings in the youth drug dance craze of the late 80's they are getting it so so so so so so so so so so so wrong...As with the later years of the minimal plod-a-thon they created, they are starting to do the same with a scene thats excisted happily for the last 20 years. So here's a handy guide for would be wankers who want to know how to royaly fck up our night out .
Play what everybody else is playing and make sure each record sort of sounds the same (You know like you did with minimal)
Only play brand new trax, unless its a classic re-release that came into Phonica that week (or Hector played it.) or got re-released by Defected.
Play loads of rubbish anthems at the end...I'll give you Nightcrawlers Push the Feeling On & Delacy Hideaway or for free.
Play every Johnny D track
fck off any funky sht its not moody enough.
Deep House is the key. |
There's a certain truth to your points Philip, but you should also be aware, and I'm quite sure you actually are, that the music business is in waves like it's always been.
detroit - chicago - looping mono techno - super minimal cologne style - and then 'minimal' in it's current form for actually quite a long period.... 5-6 years have it lasted, which I find quite long, and it's still here... but as you say, current super hype is 'deep/house'....
but I don't see it as something new that this is happening, it has always been like this and always will.
if it's bad or good? I don't know. Can be both in my opinion.
and as you write, you and I and many else can see who's just jumping the wagon and who's not.
just 2 cents |
Absolutely spot on. You can read into it as deeply and as philosophically as you like, but the fact is, the scene works in cycles and this will ALWAYS happen.
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Celltek
mnml maxi
Joined: 28 Aug 2006
Posts: 2609
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| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:28 am Post subject: |
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I don't really believe in manifesto's..
In minimal there are more frustrated dj's + producers than in any other genre I've experienced to date. What ever happened to "do your thing, and do it well!". These "rules" stated in the various manifesto are only there to be broken IMO. Producers should feel free to produce whatever they want and DJ's should have that freedom too because the ultimately the dancefloor will decide who gets to stay and who goes. The only reason simple ableton tracks get released is because some actually make people dance.. which is what its all about. I really dont care how long a producer has spend making the track, this is not important.. as long as it sounds good and people can dance to it.
Why should someone study the history of techno in order to start producing? We are living in the now. What does an 18 year old producer have to do with dance music in the late 80's? He's making music for his generation, so i'm not surprised the older techno hounds are mad as hell.
There is no way anyone can stop the current Italian minimal hype, or the baltic voices over a stripped down house-beat. Maybe we are all sick of it but as long as the dancefloor demands it we will keep hearing this music.
If people want more originality, stop booking and releasing records from people who copycat!
Some say the minimal jar is empty, well maybe it is.. Its had a good 7 years and maybe now people are ready for the next thing. If that next thing is to play your old tracks then so be it. |
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blockup
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| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 4:13 pm Post subject: |
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| omnipresence wrote: | | blockup wrote: | | ...just a tongue-in-cheek observation that me and my compadre's started to notice throught the year... |
How is that much different to Sherburne's article? |
Thats for you to work out. |
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drokkr.minimal
mnml newbie
Joined: 21 Jul 2008
Posts: 85
Location: Cork, Ireland
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blockup
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| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 6:43 pm Post subject: |
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| drokkr.minimal wrote: | one thing that nobody seemed to mention...
HAVE FUN |
I'm sure that doesn't need to be said. |
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pheek
mnml maxi
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 1905
Location: montreal
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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| blockup wrote: | | drokkr.minimal wrote: | one thing that nobody seemed to mention...
HAVE FUN |
I'm sure that doesn't need to be said. |
You can't never wish more than enough for people to have fun and be happy. That's probably the core of my own manifesto.
Manifesto's are nothing more (or less) than a code of honour. I can somehow believe that as an artist, you somehow need to go back to your roots or stick things in which you believe in. I like to think there's a bit of that in Phil's text.
One thing that strikes me, so many people HATE Myspace promo/demo submissions. I wonder why its still happening. |
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blockup
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:49 pm Post subject: |
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| pheek wrote: | | blockup wrote: | | drokkr.minimal wrote: | one thing that nobody seemed to mention...
HAVE FUN |
I'm sure that doesn't need to be said. |
You can't never wish more than enough for people to have fun and be happy. That's probably the core of my own manifesto.
Manifesto's are nothing more (or less) than a code of honour. I can somehow believe that as an artist, you somehow need to go back to your roots or stick things in which you believe in. I like to think there's a bit of that in Phil's text.
One thing that strikes me, so many people HATE Myspace promo/demo submissions. I wonder why its still happening. |
Probably because they get so many. |
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harold_f
mnml maxi
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 551
Location: miami
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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I find this dude annoying as fck.. I usually dont care much for anything him or any other "music writer" writes about.
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pheek
mnml maxi
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 1905
Location: montreal
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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| blockup wrote: | | pheek wrote: | | blockup wrote: | | drokkr.minimal wrote: | one thing that nobody seemed to mention...
HAVE FUN |
I'm sure that doesn't need to be said. |
You can't never wish more than enough for people to have fun and be happy. That's probably the core of my own manifesto.
Manifesto's are nothing more (or less) than a code of honour. I can somehow believe that as an artist, you somehow need to go back to your roots or stick things in which you believe in. I like to think there's a bit of that in Phil's text.
One thing that strikes me, so many people HATE Myspace promo/demo submissions. I wonder why its still happening. |
Probably because they get so many. |
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Storlon
mnml maxi
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 1195
Location: up in the mountains
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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| electronic music is so young and acting like it... |
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patrick bateman
mnml maxi
Joined: 07 Feb 2005
Posts: 4549
Location: Copenhagen Denmark
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| Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 7:38 am Post subject: |
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| pheek wrote: | | blockup wrote: | | drokkr.minimal wrote: | one thing that nobody seemed to mention...
HAVE FUN |
I'm sure that doesn't need to be said. |
You can't never wish more than enough for people to have fun and be happy. That's probably the core of my own manifesto.
Manifesto's are nothing more (or less) than a code of honour. I can somehow believe that as an artist, you somehow need to go back to your roots or stick things in which you believe in. I like to think there's a bit of that in Phil's text.
One thing that strikes me, so many people HATE Myspace promo/demo submissions. I wonder why its still happening. |
I want to be able to take the track to my serato and use it, therefore I don't want to listen to stuff on the myspace player.... that's also the reason why all tracks below 320 mp3's are deleted right away without giving it a listen at all...
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Celltek
mnml maxi
Joined: 28 Aug 2006
Posts: 2609
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| Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:56 am Post subject: |
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| pheek wrote: | | blockup wrote: | | pheek wrote: | | blockup wrote: | | drokkr.minimal wrote: | one thing that nobody seemed to mention...
HAVE FUN |
I'm sure that doesn't need to be said. |
You can't never wish more than enough for people to have fun and be happy. That's probably the core of my own manifesto.
Manifesto's are nothing more (or less) than a code of honour. I can somehow believe that as an artist, you somehow need to go back to your roots or stick things in which you believe in. I like to think there's a bit of that in Phil's text.
One thing that strikes me, so many people HATE Myspace promo/demo submissions. I wonder why its still happening. |
Probably because they get so many. |
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Isn't that the whole point of Myspace (music)? To network.. share music
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Castronova
mnml mmbr
Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 137
Location: Hong Kong, [which isn't really] China
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| Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting read besides the lengthy, typically Pitchfork intro.
1) fck about 98% of those rules.
2a) If you're a DJ, I don't care how you got your music or what format it's in, as long as you've got it, it's good, and it works. It helps if you paid for it.
2b) If you're a producer, I don't care what computer program or $10,000 rare vintage synth you made your song on: If it's good, it's good.
3) I'm not even a label owner and I don't have time to listen to the demos that come trickling into my inbox on Myspace. It would be nice if there was about 10 more hours in a day for me spend leisurely filtering out the odd gem amongst hundreds of digital dirt clods. (see below)
4) Analog/VST/Ableton/breakdowns/122 BPM/re-edits are not the problem so much as the producers that produce sh!t music, the DJs that broadcast it, and the people dancing to it who should know better -- but don't, because they don't have an extra 10 hours a day to leisurely scroll through music, so they rely on shity DJs that rely on even shittier producers for their music.
5) I'm tired of elitists preaching about the way it used to be done, as if it's the only way it always has to be done. No disrespect to the years of experience and knowledge that they may have on me -- just don't disrespect the years of experience that I haven't yet made, or the different brand of knowledge I've studied to make and play out music. No big deal if you don't know techno history, so long as you aren't making cliches or trash that have already run their course -- we live in now, not 25 years ago.
6) Ridiculous, outdated limits and guidelines like "don't use a computer unless..." should be replaced with "be tasteful."
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